1 20:59:32
   2 Etienne
   3 Hello Kim 
   4 20:59:53
   5 KimNilsson
   6 Evening 
   7 21:00:27
   8 sat
   9 Good evening! 
  10 21:00:37
  11 Etienne
  12 Good evening Sascha 
  13 21:05:39
  14 egal
  15 salue 
  16 21:05:55
  17 Etienne
  18 Good evening Dirk 
  19 21:06:32
  20 We are still waiting for president and vice president. Should we start without them? 
  21 21:06:49
  22 mcr
  23 hello. 
  24 21:07:11
  25 egal
  26 is the board-meeting now or in one hour? 
  27 21:07:17
  28 Etienne
  29 Hello Michael, good morning! 
  30 21:07:19
  31 mcr
  32 I think it's now, but I could be wrong. 
  33 21:07:24
  34 sat
  35 No, it is now. 
  36 21:07:30
  37 mcr
  38 It's 15:00 here :-) 
  39 21:07:51
  40 egal
  41 timezones still suck ... ;-( 
  42 21:08:02
  43 Etienne
  44 Sorry, I was confused, last year we had some Australians and it was 6:00 there. 
  45 21:08:29
  46 egal
  47 especially, if they change every now and then, when it starts to get winter or summer ... 
  48 21:09:43
  49 Etienne
  50 I propose to start without president for the moment. 
  51 21:10:17
  52 Does soemone like to take the chair until Brian arrives? 
  53 21:11:07
  54 KimNilsson
  55 I can chair till Brian arrives. 
  56 21:11:13
  57 Etienne
  58 OK 
  59 21:11:19
  60 The Agenda is here: https://wiki.cacert.org/Brain/CAcertInc/Committee/MeetingAgendasAndMinutes/2022-01-06 
  61 21:12:03
  62 KimNilsson
  63 I then declare the meeting open, 2022-01-06 20:11 UTC 
  64 21:13:07
  65 KimNilsson
  66 First order of the meting is who will make minutes, I assume someone who has edit access to wiki, or the Google Docs from 2021-08-05, unless a new document is created and shared? 
  67 21:13:28
  68 Etienne
  69 I will write them after the meeting. 
  70 21:13:37
  71 KimNilsson
  72 (neither of which I have access to do) 
  73 21:13:53
  74 OK, Etienne will make minutes. 
  75 21:14:21
  76 Does cacert-board-private or cacert-board maillist include any items that need to be disclosed to Members? 
  77 21:15:13
  78 Etienne
  79 I do not think so. 
  80 21:15:40
  81 KimNilsson
  82 Alright. 
  83 21:16:29
  84 Has everyone read and are ok with the minutes from 02.12.2021? 
  85 21:16:32
  86 Etienne
  87 https://wiki.cacert.org/Brain/CAcertInc/Committee/MeetingAgendasAndMinutes/2021-12-02#Minutes 
  88 21:16:43
  89 mcr
  90 I am okay with the minutes. 
  91 21:17:14
  92 KimNilsson
  93 Then I move to accept the minutes of the committee meeting of 2nd December 2021. 
  94 21:17:21
  95 sat
  96 I second and Aye. 
  97 21:17:22
  98 Etienne
  99 second and aye 
 100 21:17:27
 101 mcr
 102 aye 
 103 21:18:17
 104 KimNilsson
 105 Thank you. A very short point of order there. Sorry for not knowing 100%, but some of these points don't really reuqire voting machine, right? Like the one we just did is good? 
 106 21:18:50
 107 Etienne
 108 No, voting machine is only at the AGM. 
 109 21:19:01
 110 Here we write just aye or naye. 
 111 21:19:09
 112 KimNilsson
 113 Awesome, on to the next point. 
 114 21:19:38
 115 → FD est entré 
 116 21:20:01
 117 KimNilsson
 118 Business, 2.1 It's been suggested that "Wiki Edit Access should be granted by support" 
 119 21:20:08
 120 mcr
 121 doorbell, back in 5min. 
 122 21:20:37
 123 Etienne
 124 There is a problem with wiki access. Support should do this, but has not the writing rights granted. As we do not know who can grant this, I propose to vote a board motion and hope that helps (or people who can change it accept a board motion). 
 125 21:20:58
 126 KimNilsson
 127 That sound like a great idea. 
 128 21:21:07
 129 sat
 130 Does anyone know what the current procedure is if someone wants write access? 
 131 21:21:30
 132 KimNilsson
 133 hehe, apparently not, since neither mcr nor me has gained it in two months :-) 
 134 21:21:40
 135 Etienne
 136 Someone from https://wiki.cacert.org/AdminGroup is allowed to grant 
 137 21:21:40
 138 permissions. Currently "Mario Lipinski" and "dirkastrath" are listed there. 
 139 21:21:40
 140 According to Dirk it was previously possible for Support engineers too but I 
 141 21:21:40
 142 do not know how this is implemented. The Wiki configuration has two ACL 
 143 21:21:41
 144 lines: 
 145 21:21:41
 146  
 147 21:21:41
 148 acl_rights_before = u"AdminGroup:read,write,delete,revert,admin" 
 149 21:21:41
 150 acl_rights_default = u"EditorGroup:read,write,delete,revert Known:read All:read" 
 151 21:21:41
 152  
 153 21:21:41
 154 There is https://wiki.cacert.org/SupportGroup that points to "dirkastrath", 
 155 21:21:41
 156 "JSteijlen" and "MichaelTänzer" but I see no ACL that would grant them 
 157 21:21:41
 158 permissions. 
 159 21:21:41
 160  
 161 21:21:41
 162 Effectively 
 163 21:21:41
 164 https://infradocs.cacert.org/systems/wiki.html#application-administration is 
 165 21:21:41
 166 still true. I don't know who is the correct person to give access to the 
 167 21:21:41
 168 Wiki and how the process was in the past. 
 169 21:21:41
 170  
 171 21:21:41
 172  
 173 21:21:41
 174 Kind regards 
 175 21:21:41
 176 Jan 
 177 21:22:20
 178 KimNilsson
 179 Thank you, Etienne 
 180 21:22:22
 181 → bdmc est entré 
 182 21:22:34
 183 Etienne
 184 So we are in the fog during a dark night! 
 185 21:22:40
 186 sat
 187 It's so sad. 
 188 21:22:40
 189 egal
 190 i expected ales to have access there ... but it seems, that he has no access ... 
 191 21:22:41
 192 bdmc
 193 Am I 22 minutes late, or 44 minutes early? 
 194 21:22:52
 195 Speaking of the dark. 
 196 21:22:56
 197 sat
 198 late 
 199 21:23:04
 200 egal
 201 ... but ales (as support) did not ping me with the support-case-number ... ;-( 
 202 21:23:05
 203 Etienne
 204 12 minutes late, Kim is chairing until you arrive... 
 205 21:23:05
 206 bdmc
 207 Apologies. 
 208 21:23:05
 209 sat
 210 20 UTC is the time 
 211 21:23:18
 212 KimNilsson
 213 bdmc: I started running the show, mate. 
 214 21:23:35
 215 bdmc
 216 KimNilsson:  Thank you -- feel free to continue. 
 217 21:23:57
 218 KimNilsson
 219 To close out this issue, I'd like to _move that wiki edit access can also be granted by support._ 
 220 21:23:57
 221 Etienne
 222 bdmc: 2 Business - 1 Quick decisions 
 223 21:24:15
 224 I second and aye 
 225 21:24:19
 226 bdmc
 227 Aye 
 228 21:24:25
 229 sat
 230 I cannot see how such a motion can help us. 
 231 21:25:01
 232 bdmc
 233 sat: Should it not help with responsiveness? 
 234 21:25:12
 235 KimNilsson
 236 It increases the number of groups that can help out, but it will only be realised when someone who can currently edit the ACLs fix it. 
 237 21:25:36
 238 sat
 239 A few minutes ago I asked how the current procedure is for granting write access. 
 240 21:26:05
 241 Etienne
 242 There are people who can do it technically but do not have the rights. So we can back them up. 
 243 21:26:22
 244 bdmc
 245 Is there more than one person who can do this currently? 
 246 21:26:33
 247 egal
 248 @sat: write to support ... so support can do it itself ... or contact the person, who can do it ... 
 249 21:26:44
 250 sat
 251 Who is that person? 
 252 21:27:25
 253 egal
 254 mario or me ... but support (ales) did not contact me ... ;-( 
 255 21:27:39
 256 (so i don't have the support case) 
 257 21:27:41
 258 mcr
 259 back. 
 260 21:28:19
 261 I support wiki can be granted by support. 
 262 21:28:20
 263 Etienne
 264 I write to support his night. 
 265 21:28:33
 266 *this 
 267 21:28:39
 268 FD
 269 Dirk, couldn't you give right access to Ales, without him sending you an email ? Or didn't I understand ? 
 270 21:29:45
 271 Etienne
 272 Can we continue with the next topic? 
 273 21:29:51
 274 FD
 275 Yes, Ales is alive, he lost his mother at the beginning of November, but he leaves. 
 276 21:30:03
 277 Yes, Ales is alive, he lost his mother at the beginning of November, but he lives. 
 278 21:30:47
 279 KimNilsson
 280 2.2 Quick infos, 1 EUR bank account: secretary asked at GRKB 
 281 21:31:02
 282 mcr
 283 yes. 
 284 21:31:14
 285 Etienne has to contact them for process, is last I heard. 
 286 21:31:27
 287 Etienne
 288 2 CCA update has been initiated. 
 289 21:31:36
 290 3 Tax exemption: dossier is 99% compiled 
 291 21:31:42
 292 FD
 293 I guess Ales is the right person to be granted admin access to the Wiki. He is suportive of CAcert. We talked together face to face one week ago. 
 294 21:32:10
 295 Etienne
 296 4. Phone call Etienne/Dirk will take place in the first half of january. 
 297 21:32:30
 298 KimNilsson
 299 Good. 
 300 21:33:03
 301 mcr
 302 Could Secretary also control wiki access? 
 303 21:33:45
 304 FD
 305 Please, I did not understand what answer did you Etienne received from our GKB bank? 
 306 21:33:53
 307 mcr
 308 No answer yet. 
 309 21:35:04
 310 KimNilsson
 311 I agree, Secretary seems like a reasonable role to have admin access to the wiki. Also, Board members should be made members of the EditorGroup. 
 312 21:35:18
 313 FD
 314 You mean, the bank does know the pricing of having an Euro account in their book? 
 315 21:35:45
 316 mcr
 317 FD, I meant that I don't think we/Etienne has received info on EUR and MCR-access. 
 318 21:36:39
 319 Etienne
 320 The info is "Etienne asked" and the next info will be "Bank told xxxx". 
 321 21:37:05
 322 KimNilsson
 323 Thank you. Any complimentary info about the CCA update? 
 324 21:37:21
 325 FD
 326 That is what I was asking about. The bank was not able to reply to you on the fly regarding its own pricing? 
 327 21:37:45
 328 Etienne
 329 I am working on it and know who is not responsable of it. Research is on the way. 
 330 21:38:36
 331 mcr
 332 (my Canadian bank has an EU account. But, don't ask anyone about it, it doesn't exist... even though I have one...) 
 333 21:39:30
 334 FD
 335 Adressing Dirk's question about who's name we could grant write access too, on top of Ales, our colleague Mathias Fischer who supports Ales and does triage at the moment, could be granted access too. 
 336 21:39:33
 337 Etienne
 338 Kim wrote: I agree, Secretary seems like a reasonable role to have admin access to the wiki. Also, Board members should be made members of the EditorGroup.  Would you like to discuss that or make a decision? 
 339 21:40:25
 340 FD
 341 Mathias is a volunteer wanting to help CAcert at the Support Team. We planned to make him pass a background check. 
 342 21:40:30
 343 Etienne
 344 FD: If I understand Jan's mail well it is support that had access, not only Ales. 
 345 21:40:35
 346 KimNilsson
 347 Etienne: They are two separate things, I assume? Board members having edit access to the wiki, I though was a given ... it just hasn't happened yet. 
 348 21:40:48
 349 "I thought was a given..." 
 350 21:41:02
 351 FD
 352 @Etienne. OK Fine. Support has writte access. 
 353 21:42:01
 354 KimNilsson
 355 To follow up on the other suggestion I move that Secretary be given admin access to the wiki. 
 356 21:42:10
 357 bdmc
 358 Second 
 359 21:42:57
 360 FD
 361 yes 
 362 21:43:02
 363 mcr
 364 I agree. aye. 
 365 21:43:05
 366 Etienne
 367 abst 
 368 21:44:17
 369 bdmc
 370 aye 
 371 21:44:54
 372 KimNilsson
 373 Thank you. Am I to understqand that Dirk is present (using pseudonym), and currently the only one in the room able to change that setting right now? If so, can these changes be made now, please. 
 374 21:44:57
 375 sat
 376 aye 
 377 21:45:13
 378 FD
 379 good idea 
 380 21:46:06
 381 KimNilsson
 382 In the meantime we'll move on to the next point. 
 383 21:46:22
 384 2.3.1 Finance team (Michael), New ERP / decision / who, where, until when (Michael) 
 385 21:47:01
 386 Etienne
 387 Michael, everithing on the way or do you need some support from us? 
 388 21:47:43
 389 FD
 390 Wacław has a kind of professional burn-out at the moment. This is the main reason why he declined his nomination to the committee. I talked to him face to face three weeks ago. 
 391 21:48:21
 392 mcr
 393 what is this "face to face" thing you speak of? 
 394 21:48:48
 395 FD
 396 He is OK for taking care of the new CRM/ERP in the future, however, we agreed that I will second him at the begining, reding NextERP's documentation and performing a first install, with his support. 
 397 21:48:56
 398 mcr
 399 I need to get CommunityAssociation page updated on www.cacert.org.  I also wonder if we can move towards having "api.cacert.org" where all the code is, and www.cacert.org could be a static site. 
 400 21:49:12
 401 FD, okay, you will are installing NextERP then? 
 402 21:49:46
 403 FD
 404 I talked to Wacław by phone. Not by mail. Yes you are right, I am going to install NextERP, if I achieve to do it. 
 405 21:50:18
 406 Etienne
 407 Thank you very much FD! 
 408 21:50:21
 409 KimNilsson
 410 FD: Tell Wacław to be careful with his personal/professional life. 
 411 21:50:40
 412 mcr
 413 ditto. 
 414 21:50:40
 415 FD
 416 It would have been better to have a seasoned sysadmin to do it, however I will try to comply with the quality rules expected by Jan, espacially regarding the writting of a documentation 
 417 21:51:16
 418 mcr
 419 FD: just install it once, and assume that it will have to be installed a second time, better. 
 420 21:51:37
 421 KimNilsson
 422 Thank you, FD that answers the "who" question. What about clarification of "where"? 
 423 21:51:46
 424 FD
 425 My concern at the moment is that Jan declared not wanting to participate to any now work on our infrastructure, until we make the overhal situation better from his perspective. 
 426 21:52:18
 427 mcr
 428 we have a VM that FD arranged, I can get FD access to it via IPv6. 
 429 21:52:22
 430 FD
 431 So, I could make an install, but for putting NextERP in production, it is a work to be performed by Jan. 
 432 21:52:41
 433 mcr
 434 lxc containers can be transferred rather easily. 
 435 21:54:49
 436 FD
 437 Regarding the VM, I asked my good colleague Brent to grant us access to one VM in his infrastructure. It will have 4 vCores and 8GB RAM with a huge swap on Optane ans a natted IPv4 public address for getting into the VM from the Internet. 
 438 21:56:14
 439 FD
 440 This is a talk I had with Brent 10 days ago. I have to ask him again to do it this week-end. I suspects that the tricky part is configuring its firewall for natting it IP address. He is scarce with IPv4, hence the fine tuning which he has to do. 
 441 21:57:34
 442 KimNilsson
 443 Ok, good, then that's moving along. Those involved can continue that conversation. Now on to the next point of this meeting. 
 444 21:57:48
 445 Etienne
 446 This happened before Michael's time: We had terrible problems with our payment service provider PayPal Australia Pty, so we wanted to withdraw all money to our bank account if possible. My suggestion as a first step: USD and AUD from PP to bank account. EUR at the moment still waiting until it is clear with the bank account. So clear accounts to the nearest $10, the few cents will then stay with PP ;-) Details can be discussed bilaterally between secretary and treasurer. 
 447 21:57:54
 448 FD
 449 The actual "where" question is "should NextERP be in production on Infra03"? I guess yes. But it depends of Jan to do so. 
 450 21:58:56
 451 Etienne
 452 Any questions? Or vote the motion directly? 
 453 21:59:06
 454 KimNilsson
 455 2.2.3.2 Info - decision about USD and AUD in PP (Michael) (thanks, Etienne  - I was just getting to that) 
 456 22:00:04
 457 mcr
 458 I want all the cash out of paypal and into a real bank, thus me waiting for access to Bank. 
 459 22:00:12
 460 bdmc
 461 mcr: Are we ready to make this change immediately, or would you like things to settle a bit more? 
 462 22:00:21
 463 I see that you just answered this question. 
 464 22:00:43
 465 mcr
 466 bdmc: I'd have done it on day two if I had access to the right account to connect things up. 
 467 22:00:59
 468 Etienne
 469 We can also move EUR to tha CHF account. At the moment we will not lose money while changing from EUR to CHF. 
 470 22:01:43
 471 KimNilsson
 472 Then... I move that all funds from PP is transferred to the bank account. (making the wording as simple as possible) 
 473 22:01:59
 474 Etienne
 475 second and aye 
 476 22:02:40
 477 FD
 478 Kim, I am fine with that, just a question regarding "how" to do it efficiently, i.e. keeping currency exchange fees as low as possible ? 
 479 22:03:12
 480 KimNilsson
 481 FD: I assume the person doing the actual transfer will make sure of that. Feels pointless to discuss that here. 
 482 22:03:15
 483 bdmc
 484 aye 
 485 22:03:34
 486 KimNilsson
 487 That's why there is a Treasurer. 
 488 22:03:56
 489 Etienne
 490 Details between Secretary and Treasurer. Paypal has a bank account on file. if MCR changes this from Westpac to GRKB we can make withdrawals with almost or no charges. 
 491 22:04:07
 492 FD
 493 This is not as easy as Paypal -> GKB. Likely, I has to go first from Paypal to WestPac. Then from WestPac to GKB. But WestPac is not in the SEPA European Payment Area. 
 494 22:04:26
 495 Etienne
 496 MCR and I will check this after the meeting. 
 497 22:04:37
 498 KimNilsson
 499 Thank you, Etienne 
 500 22:05:04
 501 FD
 502 @Etienne, OK. @Michael: will you take the risk to perform a change at Paypal, such as the bank account of the benificiary? 
 503 22:05:28
 504 mcr
 505 I thought we already discussed this a few meetings ago.  I would prefer to transfer to a EUR account at GKB. 
 506 22:05:41
 507 But, anything is better than leaving it in Paypal. 
 508 22:06:06
 509 FD
 510 I am very positive regarding this initiative. Just it might lock us out again from our funds, as Paypal's politics and regulations looks very obscure and unsafe of the end customer (us). I know you know it. 
 511 22:06:14
 512 mcr
 513 FD, it's not hard to add a bank account.  I don't expect any problems.  But, I can't do anything until I have the access to GKB. 
 514 22:06:29
 515 FD, right now, we don't have access to our funds, because they are in paypal. 
 516 22:06:33
 517 FD
 518 OK. 
 519 22:07:04
 520 mcr
 521 it's been an hour... 
 522 22:07:09
 523 KimNilsson
 524 Good, the decision we just took doesn't restrict from doing just that, mcr (that's why I worded it as such). 
 525 22:07:37
 526 FD
 527 So your idea is: USD to EUR and AUD to EUR, am I right ? 
 528 22:07:44
 529 mcr
 530 No. 
 531 22:08:12
 532 ⓘ sat s'appelle désormais sat|away 
 533 22:08:23
 534 mcr
 535 Paypal has USD and EUR. Both go to GKB. 
 536 22:08:33
 537 WestPac -> Paypal. ANd then to GKB. 
 538 22:08:46
 539 sat|away
 540 Folks, I have to leave now. Will stay away here and read on tomorrow. Bye! 
 541 22:08:48
 542 mcr
 543 transfering from WestPac anywhere else would be a disaster. 
 544 22:09:10
 545 Etienne
 546 bye Sascha, thank you for beeing with us this hour. 
 547 22:09:18
 548 FD
 549 Will you want to change USD to EUR through Paypal? 
 550 22:09:54
 551 Etienne
 552 FD the treasurer will check the change rates and find the best way before doing it. 
 553 22:10:02
 554 FD
 555 OK 
 556 22:10:14
 557 mcr
 558 thank you Etienne. 
 559 22:11:09
 560 FD
 561 Etienne, did you asked formally to Sascha if he wants to accept his nomination to the committee for 2022? 
 562 22:12:37
 563 KimNilsson
 564 2.2.3.3 Board asks whether there is anything that they can do to assist the Finance Team? (keep it brief, as time is running, and we have a lot more on the plate, which we don't want to push)2.2.3.3 Board asks whether there is anything that they can do to assist the Finance Team? (keep it brief, as time is running, and we have a lot more on the plate, which we don't want to push) 
 565 22:12:55
 566 mcr
 567 I answered this already :-) 
 568 22:13:03
 569 KimNilsson
 570 thank you. 
 571 22:13:27
 572 2.2.4. OpenID Connect (Brian) <--! integration / who is in charge / what is done / what will be done until end of year / Board asks whether there is anything that they can do to assist 
 573 22:14:10
 574 grrr - it's of course 2.4 
 575 22:14:12
 576 bdmc
 577 I need to meet with Jan, Dirk and Ted regarding this.  I have already talked, briefly, with Jan, and will continue. 
 578 22:15:15
 579 bdmc
 580 At present, I am still learning the way forward. 
 581 22:15:18
 582 Etienne
 583 by the way, bdmc we got a of $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ for this. 
 584 22:16:04
 585 FD
 586 I thought the grant was to be delivered in EUR? 
 587 22:16:16
 588 bdmc
 589 When we get closer to actually accomplishing something here, I am going to propose that Dirk and Jan be paid ( some amount to be determined later ) for the work that they have already done. 
 590 22:16:29
 591 Etienne
 592 Sent 7800 EUR, arrived on 27.12.2021 8590.70 CHF 
 593 22:16:48
 594 bdmc
 595 Etienne: thank you for the news 
 596 22:16:52
 597 FD
 598 Thank you Etienne for the info. 
 599 22:18:31
 600 KimNilsson
 601 bdmc: Ok, good. It feels like a project that deserves being mentioned/updated on each coming board meeting, both on what hs happened and what will happen (short run, and long run). Is that what the board can expect? 
 602 22:18:38
 603 bdmc
 604 That's all from me for the moment. 
 605 22:18:50
 606 Yes, that sounds like a good plan. 
 607 22:18:55
 608 KimNilsson
 609 Thank you. 
 610 22:19:10
 611 bdmc
 612 That needs to be added to the "Assigned Tasks" list for me. 
 613 22:19:20
 614 FD
 615 @Brian: I hope you could be paid too, for your work as a project manager for the integration of CAcert to OpenID. 
 616 22:20:22
 617 FD
 618 This is the goal of that grant: to be received by the hands of those taking part to the achievement of the developement, documentation, management, etc. 
 619 22:21:24
 620 KimNilsson
 621 Next order of business. 
 622 22:21:26
 623 2.5 Background Check - has no info, so could the person responsible for it please add comments here? 
 624 22:21:34
 625 Etienne
 626 Who has the list with all the candidates? 
 627 22:22:07
 628 Or let's quickly collect it here and I will put it in the minutes. 
 629 22:22:08
 630 FD
 631 I would suggest that people report to you, Brian, about the volume of hours they work on the OpenID project. The hourly rate which we declared to the RIPE to be ours is 30EUR/h. 
 632 22:22:17
 633 bdmc
 634 My memory says: Gero, Peter Nunn, Mathias, others? 
 635 22:22:27
 636 FD
 637 You are very right 
 638 22:22:53
 639 Etienne
 640 Later some board members as FD or Etienne or ? 
 641 22:23:04
 642 Thank you for the names. 
 643 22:23:19
 644 FD
 645 Gero Treuner, Mathias Fischer 
 646 22:23:33
 647 bdmc
 648 Partly it depends on the work that people are being asked to do and are volunteering to do. 
 649 22:24:20
 650 FD
 651 I volunteer with pleasure and interest to be background checked. I am curious at looking to our new procedure from its inside side. 
 652 22:25:00
 653 @Dirk: adding Sascha to the list of people to be background check is a good idea, yes. 
 654 22:25:09
 655 mcr
 656 yes, RIPE project should get regular updates to board. 
 657 22:27:07
 658 KimNilsson
 659 Alright. We got a list of names. No other comments regarding Background Check? If not, let's move on. 
 660 22:27:53
 661 2.6 New CSR software (Ted) - INFO - to Ted's knowledge there was no progress with this software in 2021. He don't expect any progress in 2022. 
 662 22:28:13
 663 FD
 664 Kim, the general comment is that it goes very slow, we have to motivate Bernhard to make these Background Checks to happen, past week I committed to give him a call, I still have to do so. 
 665 22:28:38
 666 KimNilsson
 667 FD: thank you 
 668 22:28:39
 669 Etienne
 670 to Ted's knowledge there was no progress with this software in 2021. He don't expect any progress in 2022. That is bad news. But for the moment we will probably first finish more pressing things. 
 671 22:28:58
 672 I am the watch dog for New CSR ;-) 
 673 22:29:25
 674 FD
 675 CSR: that's just that the Java based Proof of Work delivered by Tim was far away from what we understood as possibly being a working solution. 
 676 22:30:11
 677 KimNilsson
 678 yeah, I noted there are a few logged issues, and some have suggestions, but nothing that really works as easy as before? 
 679 22:30:20
 680 FD
 681 Again, text communication did not help to find a commun mindset. 
 682 22:31:34
 683 FD
 684 Software development team should meet every two month or so, in order to make integration and understanding beetween its member better, and o invite potential new comers to meet witj them, too. 
 685 22:32:15
 686 ← LambertHofstra a quitté (Quit: Leaving.) 
 687 22:33:25
 688 Etienne
 689 Which board member will care about this core topic and get in touch with Software regularly? 
 690 22:34:47
 691 FD
 692 Brian would the best of the Puppet Master in this role. 
 693 22:36:12
 694 bdmc
 695 If you wish. 
 696 22:36:18
 697 FD
 698 Thank you Brian. 
 699 22:37:02
 700 bdmc
 701 Put it on my Assigned Tasks. 
 702 22:37:21
 703 Etienne
 704 I will do it, bdmc. 
 705 22:38:30
 706 KimNilsson
 707 Next item on the agenda is very similar, and perhaps it will be accomplished by the just now assigned task? :-) 
 708 22:38:32
 709 2.7 Software reviews - who will care about this core topic? 
 710 22:39:09
 711 mcr
 712 where would the reviews be recorded? 
 713 22:39:21
 714 Etienne
 715 Oups, I thought we were already there. 
 716 22:39:41
 717 KimNilsson
 718 Etienne: it is/was sort of. 
 719 22:39:46
 720 FD
 721 This is a topic for Brian as well, as he is the one having the head on the shoulders and understanding what our priorities are in regards to making our code evolve. 
 722 22:40:27
 723 @ Speaking under the control of Dirk, the reviews are recorded as "notes" in Mantis. 
 724 22:40:42
 725 @Michael: Speaking under the control of Dirk, the reviews are recorded as "notes" in Mantis. 
 726 22:41:11
 727 mcr
 728 so pretty hard to find/collect.  If I can get access, I think that they could go into the audit record. 
 729 22:42:00
 730 bdmc
 731 mcr: If you are not an Admin in Mantis, that can fairly easily be remedied. 
 732 22:42:07
 733 KimNilsson
 734 I'm all for doing enduser testing, as I can definitely follow intructions, but I am not a professional developer, and can't review code (other than some tiny bits of bash, javascript, and just maybe a few lines of python). 
 735 22:42:41
 736 I'll gladly test to see if I can break things. :-) 
 737 22:42:49
 738 bdmc
 739 KimNilsson: There are several different layers needed. Certainly "functional" testing of fixes is needed. 
 740 22:43:26
 741 Also, there are some changes that involve changing text on a page, which should be able to be done by anyone. 
 742 22:43:28
 743 egal
 744 the usual process is: somebody creates a bug, somebody writes the fix, somebody will test it, somebody will do the review and somebody (having ABC for software) will send the patch with mantis-bug-number to critical team 
 745 22:43:40
 746 KimNilsson
 747 I'm farly good with words, so documenting processes for endusers is also something I can do. 
 748 22:44:07
 749 egal
 750 so every patch being done on critical system could be tracked by the bug number in mantis 
 751 22:44:50
 752 obviously: some of the above "sombodies" could be the same, but not all ... 
 753 22:45:34
 754 KimNilsson
 755 egal: Thank you. 
 756 22:45:35
 757 egal
 758 means: tests and review can't be done by the person writing the code ... ;-) 
 759 22:45:44
 760 KimNilsson
 761 exactly :-) 
 762 22:46:58
 763 egal
 764 so in theory i could key in the bug and write the code, somebody else does the test and review and sends it to me to get it installed on critical server(s) 
 765 22:48:27
 766 egal
 767 according to our policy software teamlead could decice, if only one review is enough before it's sent to critical team ... unfortunately this does not work ... 
 768 22:48:45
 769 ... due to a conflict of positions ... ;-( 
 770 22:50:51
 771 FD
 772 Well, in the future we should ask another volunteer to be the team leader of the Software Development team. This is a good transition to our next topic: recruitment and team staffing. 
 773 22:51:59
 774 FD
 775 Kim, our dear chair of the day, would we want to go ahead ? 
 776 22:52:32
 777 KimNilsson
 778 Yes, but before staffing there is one more... 
 779 22:53:24
 780 2.8 To remember... with many points - am I to assume that these are just things the board should look at whenever appropriate, but not necessarily today? 
 781 22:53:59
 782 Etienne
 783 Yes. This is just to not forget during the year. 
 784 22:54:06
 785 KimNilsson
 786 OK 
 787 22:54:20
 788 Etienne
 789 3. Question Time 
 790 22:55:01
 791 FD
 792 Are we skipping 2.9 too? 
 793 22:55:50
 794 KimNilsson
 795 I'll just mention... Remote Assurance - I've seen some small steps taken towards making this possible, which makes me glad. 
 796 22:56:16
 797 FD: no, Etienne is just getting ahead of himself. 
 798 22:56:16
 799 FD
 800 Dirk took part to the talk too, on the Policy mailing list. 
 801 22:56:55
 802 egal
 803 not only on the policy mailing list ... i answered one mail to software mailing list ... 
 804 22:57:07
 805 ... and had a chat to iang earlier the day ... 
 806 22:57:37
 807 FD
 808 Very good too. 
 809 22:58:21
 810 egal
 811 iang agreed, that some review is necessary, but it must not necessarily a "full featured" one for minor changes ... 
 812 22:58:51
 813 somehow "bending" our policies, but not breaking it ... ;-) 
 814 22:59:52
 815 egal
 816 so for updating the policies (as etienne mentioned at the beginning of this meeting) it should be possible without having two full-featured reviews ... 
 817 23:00:32
 818 (only issue is to find the correct workflow to do these policy-updates under wwww.cacert.org/policy ) 
 819 23:01:32
 820 FD
 821 Fellow members, don't you feel that the discussion has slowed down terribly in the last 15 minutes or so? Can we finish dealing with items 2.9 and 2.10 in the next few minutes? 
 822 23:01:51
 823 Etienne
 824 yes, please. 
 825 23:02:42
 826 KimNilsson
 827 2.9 Staffing the teams - There are three teams listed. 
 828 23:03:03
 829 2.9.1 Applicants to the Infrastructure team 
 830 23:03:16
 831 2.9.2 Applicants to the Development team 
 832 23:03:27
 833 2.9.3 Applicant to the Critical team 
 834 23:03:49
 835 Are there any, or is there a plan on how to find such people? 
 836 23:04:15
 837 FD
 838 We can exchange a few words about it on https://conference.germanywestcentral.cloudapp.azure.com/b/ber-n8r-r5b-a1v 
 839 23:04:32
 840 Because it will take very long to write about it. 
 841 23:06:02
 842 FD
 843 The CRM/ERP is one thing to be done for keeping track of our correspondance with new comers. 
 844 23:06:16
 845 KimNilsson
 846 Ok, let's join there for that conversation 
 847 23:06:21
 848 FD
 849 The big mail linked to CCA update is another thing we are waiting for 
 850 23:08:09
 851 egal
 852 and even i'm waiting for this mass-mailing-request ... 
 853 23:08:14
 854 Etienne
 855 The "big mail" is topic of the famous phone call with Dirk within the next eight days. 
 856 23:08:39
 857 egal
 858 sounds good ... ;-) 
 859 23:10:42
 860 FD
 861 Another idea could be to invite volunters to their very first contact to join the informal Wensday's meeting, half an hour it has started. Then, most of the meeting would be kept for the regular members, when at the same it would make very painless to get a face and voice first contact with new volunters. 
 862 23:10:59
 863 egal
 864 good idea ... 
 865 23:11:49
 866 KimNilsson
 867 yes 
 868 23:12:43
 869 Etienne
 870 I first contact with seeing is great. 
 871 23:13:03
 872 bdmc
 873 I don't know, but we seem to be scaring off new voluteers at the moment. 
 874 23:13:40
 875 ( grrrr --- voluteers should be volunteers! ) 
 876 23:14:06
 877 Etienne
 878 How to find new volunteers? Idea from FD: contact 2-3x year the donators by an e-mail. 
 879 23:16:06
 880 Etienne
 881 FD: Blog and Tweet are probably not for finding volunteers. 
 882 23:17:42
 883 mcr
 884 I went back to work 45min ago.  Is this done? 
 885 23:18:27
 886 Etienne
 887 mcr, we are talking on https://conference.germanywestcentral.cloudapp.azure.com/b/ber-n8r-r5b-a1v  about finding volunteers. 
 888 23:18:31
 889 KimNilsson
 890 mcr: Talking about how to find volunteers, and improve PR. 
 891 23:19:35
 892 KimNilsson
 893 FD: had one name Ales... as I'm fairly sure we've mentioned before, unless it's yet another Ales? 
 894 23:19:41
 895 Etienne
 896 Kim said: With the blog and Twitter, we only reach existing readers. The best way is probably to contact someone directly. 
 897 23:20:29
 898 KimNilsson
 899 To grow your audience you often hneed help from someone who has a wider or different audience. They can retweet, reblog or review what CAcert does. 
 900 23:20:36
 901 Etienne
 902 KimNilsson: Yes, only one Ales K at CAcert ;-) 
 903 23:31:15
 904 KimNilsson
 905 Ok, conversation on the topic has been good. Also a bit about the Support team. But as I see it, there is no new applicants to either of the three listed teams, so I feel we need to move on. 
 906 23:31:50
 907 FD
 908 Of course. Thank you for the short but instructive live talk. 
 909 23:32:17
 910 KimNilsson
 911 2.10 Access to local systems for board members 
 912 23:33:32
 913 KimNilsson
 914 Kim, have access to Nextcloud, no edit access to wiki 
 915 23:33:34
 916 FD
 917 One point on 2.10. Wacław declined to be a member on our committee for the present year. Then we have at least one vacant seat. Etienne, did you ask formally to Sascha, if he accepts his nomination to the committee ? 
 918 23:34:38
 919 Etienne
 920 sat and FD can do NextCloud access. 
 921 23:36:45
 922 KimNilsson
 923 Ok, that means board members wihtout Nextcloud access can request that from either of those two. 
 924 23:36:57
 925 FD
 926 Mario and Dirk officially are admins of our Wiki. Unfortunately, Dirk cannot have access to the wiki application as an admin. We are relying on Mario for perhaps creating additional admins? Dirk will ask Jan to help him to recover his access, too. 
 927 23:37:24
 928 KimNilsson
 929 NOW, let's move on to 3. Question time. :-) 
 930 23:37:35
 931 There is no published question. 
 932 23:37:44
 933 Only deciding on next meetings. 
 934 23:37:56
 935 Etienne
 936 Had you had a look to https://blog.cacert.org today? 
 937 23:38:00
 938 3.2.2022 
 939 23:39:37
 940 KimNilsson
 941 Then it feels like today's board meeting agenda is at an end. Everyone ok with that? 
 942 23:40:09
 943 Etienne
 944 OK. Thank you KimNilsson for be the chair of the meeting! 
 945 23:40:54
 946 bdmc
 947 KimNilsson:  Yes, thank you very much to taking this role. 
 948 23:41:12
 949 KimNilsson
 950 I then declare the meeting closed, 2022-01-06 22:41 UTC 
 951 23:41:48
 952 Etienne
 953 Good bye America, good night Europe. 
 954 23:42:02
 955 bdmc
 956 Good Night everyone. 
 957 23:42:56
 958 FD
 959 Thank you Kim for having been such a driving force in the conduct of the meeting. 
 960 23:43:02
 961 Bye! 
 962 23:43:15
 963 KimNilsson
 964 Good night everyone. 
 965 23:43:52
 966 Etienne
 967 Good night Kim 
 968 23:46:53